they can; less of
that desire to oppress him and to use him as a machine than there is in
England. But, observe, I do not lean upon that point; and I do not quite
see how that bears upon the question, because, whatever interest there
may be in foreign countries, or in ours, it is not as much as it should
be in either.

But you were throwing a slur upon the character of the upper classes in
this country, by insinuating that abroad a great deal more interest was
taken in the working classes than in England. Now I assert, that quite
the contrary is the fact.--I should be very sorry to express all the
feelings that I have respecting the relations between the upper classes
and the working classes in this country; it is a subject which cannot at
present be discussed, and one upon which I would decline any further
examination.

159. You stated that the working men were not so happy in this country
as they were abroad, pursuing the same occupations?--I should think
certainly not.

You have been in Switzerland?--Yes.

And at Zurich?--Not lately.

That is the seat of a great linen manufacture?--I have never examined
the manufactures there, nor have I looked at Switzerland as a
manufacturing country.

But you stated that there was much more interest taken in the
intellectual developments of the working classes in foreign countries
than in England?--Yes; but I was not thinking of Switzerland or of
Zurich. I was thinking of France, and I was thinking of the working
classes generally, not specially the manufacturing working classes. I
used the words "working classes" generally.

Then do you withdraw the expression that you made use of, that in
foreign countries the upper classes take more interest in the condition
of the working classes, than they do in England?--I do not withdraw it;
I only said that it was my impression.

But you cannot establish it?--No.

Therefore it is merely a matter of individual impression?--Entirely so.

You said, I think, that abroad the people enjoy their public
institutions better, because inspectors do not follow them about?--I did
not say so. I was asked the question whether I thought teaching should
be given by persons accompanying the workman about, and I said certainly
not. I would rather leave him to himself, with such information as
could be given to him by printed documents.

160. _Mr. Sclater Booth._ With regard to the National Gallery, are you
aware that there is great pressure an