many kinds of base
conduct, which, unless honourableness is naturally to have the most
influence, must, or at least it is not easy to explain why they should
not, overcome a wise man; and, not to go hunting for too many instances,
it is quite clear, that virtue deservedly praised, must cut off all the
approaches of pleasure.

Do not, now, expect any more arguments from me. Look, Torquatus, yourself,
into your own mind; turn the question over in all your thoughts; examine
yourself, whether you would prefer to pass your life in the enjoyment of
perpetual pleasure, in that tranquillity which you have often felt, free
from all pain, with the addition also of that blessing which you often
speak of as an addition, but which is, in fact, an impossible one, the
absence of all fear; or, while deserving well of all nations, and bearing
assistance and safety to all who are in need of it, to encounter even the
distresses of Hercules. For so our ancestors, even in the case of a god,
called labours which were unavoidable by the most melancholy name,
distresses.(44) I would require you, and compel you to answer me, if I
were not afraid that you might say that Hercules himself performed those
exploits, which he performed with the greatest labour for the safety of
nations, for the sake of pleasure.

And when I had said this,--I know, said Torquatus, who it is that I have to
thank for this; and although I might be able to do something myself, yet I
am still more glad to find my friends better prepared than I am.

I suppose you mean Syro and Philodemus, excellent citizens and most
learned men. You are right, said he. Come, then, said I. But it would be
more fair for Triarius to give some opinion on this discussion of ours.
Indeed, said he smiling, it would be very unfair, at least on this
subject: for you manage the question more gently; but this man attacks us
after the fashion of the Stoics. Then Triarius said, Hereafter I will
speak more boldly still: for I shall have all these arguments which I have
just heard ready to my hand; and I will not begin before I see you
equipped by those philosophers whom you mention.

And when this had been said, we made an end both of our walk and of our
discussion.

Third Book Of The Treatise On The Chief Good And Evil.

I. I think, Brutus, that Pleasure, if she were to speak for herself, and
had not such pertinacious advocates, would yield to Virtue, as having been
vanquished in the prec