s for
me not to go about much. I used to be able to go about and speak and
the churches would give me something, but since this new 'issue' come
out, theology and dogology and all such as that, nobody cares to pay
any 'tention to me. Think you are crazy now if you say 'amen.' Don't
nobody carry on the church now but three people--the preacher, he
preaches a sermon; the choir, he sings a song; and another man, he
lifts a collection. People go to church all the years now and never
pray once.

"I get some help from the Welfare. They used to pay me ten dollars
pension. They cut me down from ten to eight. And now they cut me down
to four. They cut the breath out of me this time.

"I got some mighty good young brothers never pass me up without givin'
me a dime or fifteen cents. Then I got some that always pass me up and
never give me nothing. I have built churches and helped organize
churches from here back to Mississippi.

"I don't know what's goin' to become of our folks. All they study is
drinking whiskey and gamblin' and runnin' after women. They don't
care for nothin'. What's ruinin' this country is women votin'. When a
woman comes up to a man and smiles at him, he'll do what she wants him
to do whether it's right or wrong.

"The best part of our preachers is got so they are dishonest. Stealing
to keep up automobiles. Some of them have churches that ain't no
bigger than this room."

Interviewer's Comment

The statements of Needham Love like those of Ella Wilson are not
consistent on the subject of age. It is evident, however, that he is
eighty years old or older. He thinks so. He has memories of slave
times. He has some old friends who think him older.

Interviewer: Samuel S. Taylor
Person interviewed: Louis Lucas
1320 Pulaski Street, Little Rock, Arkansas
Age: 83

Masters, Birth, Parents, Grandparents

"I was born in 1855 down on Bayou Bartholomew near Pine Bluff,
Jefferson County.

"My mother's name was Louisa. She married a man named Bill Cardrelle
after freedom. Her husband in slavery time was Sam Lucas. He belonged
to a man by the name of O'Neil. They took him in the War and he never
did come back to her. (He didn't much believe he was my father, but I
went in his name anyway.)

"My mother's father's name was Jacob Boyd. I was young, but I know
that. He was free and didn't belong to nobody. That was right here in
Arkansas. He had three other daughters besides my mother,