that it is in
harmony with science. In other words, I have lived to see a change
of standards. When I was a boy, science was measured by the Bible.
Now the Bible is measured by science. This is an immense step.
So it is impossible for me to conceive what kind of a mind a man
has, who finds in the history of the church the fact that it has
been a source of truth. How can any one come to the conclusion
that the Catholic Church has been a source of truth, a source of
intellectual light? How can anyone believe that the church of John
Calvin has been a source of truth? If its creed is not true, if
its doctrines are mistakes, if its dogmas are monstrous delusions,
how can it be said to have been a source of truth?

My opinion is that Dr. Briggs will not be satisfied with the step
he has taken. He has turned his face a little toward the light.
The farther he walks the harder it will be for him to turn back.
The probability is that the orthodox will turn him out, and the
process of driving out men of thought and men of genius will go on
until the remnant will be as orthodox as they are stupid.

_Question_. Do you think mankind is drifting away from the
supernatural?

_Answer_. My belief is that the supernatural has had its day.
The church must either change or abdicate. That is to say, it must
keep step with the progress of the world or be trampled under foot.
The church as a power has ceased to exist. To-day it is a matter
of infinite indifference what the pulpit thinks unless there comes
the voice of heresy from the sacred place. Every orthodox minister
in the United States is listened to just in proportion that he
preaches heresy. The real, simon-pure, orthodox clergyman delivers
his homilies to empty benches, and to a few ancient people who know
nothing of the tides and currents of modern thought. The orthodox
pulpit to-day has no thought, and the pews are substantially in
the same condition. There was a time when the curse of the church
whitened the face of a race, but now its anathema is the food of
laughter.

_Question_. What, in your judgment, is to be the outcome of the
present agitation in religious circles?

_Answer_. My idea is that people more and more are declining the
postponement of happiness to another world. The general tendency
is to enjoy the present. All religions have taught men that the
pleasures of this world are of no account; that they are nothing
but husks and rags and chaff